Pinnacle Black Ice questions

[Scouter]

I was talking to this young fella named Grumpie, and he told me that if I was to make a drying rack out of PVC that I should use a womans hair drier as the fan as they have a round outlet thingy that would mate up nicely to a PVC "t". Just a thought...
[/quote]


Young guy??? I think I read some of his post.  I didn't get that impression. I pictured a wise sage with much vision.   

That sound like a good idea if the temp can be lowered enough or if it could be set to just blow  room air.

[Scouter]

Doug67:

I was there tonight. Spent about 2 hours talking to the gal their. Very helpful but they didn't have any of the crushed neoprene suits to look at or to rent. She is the one who filled me in on the footie idea with the laced rock boots over.

I do not understand, if the crushed neoprene is more durable, why the LDS's don't use them for rentals. Perhaps it is the higher cost. They do seem to run quit a bit more.

Brian

[DetectorGuy]

I have only been diving for a couple years but if you add up all of the years of experience of the people that post in this site you would be blown away. This site has been a divers encyclopedia for me. If you want to find out anything just use the "search" tab at the top of the page and you can find it. The comments in the posts may or may not be factual, but they are the opinions and expertise of some of the most active divers in the country. I have learned an incredible amount in here just learning from other peoples dives, success's, and mistakes. A lot of the posts from years ago are still relevent today.

Let me tell you a thing about Grumpie... I have the utmost respect for the guy. He reminds me a lot of my dad. He showed me his certification cards one day and I am not exactly sure how many there were, but the stack was 3/4" to 1" thick! There are no divers that I know that have as much dive experience as that man and he is an extremely valuable resource to our diving community (and an all around good guy). If you ever get a chance you should ask him about the dry suits. I took my dry suit cert class from him. When it comes to diving he is the highest caliber.

[doug67]

Todd is the one you want to talk to about it, Jess hasn't worked there that long. I think you mite be splitting hairs with the durability thing. I'm as hard on things as most and I dont know how I would wreck my TLS350. I have the built in boots and like them and the one I rented had the separate boots and they where good to. You should go on a MSD fun dive in Crosby, you will meet lots of people who dive dry and can give opinions.

[Scouter]

Is Todd the owner? She mentioned he is very experienced. I work days so I usually end up going to shops during the evenings. So far the owners/most experienced personal have been gone for the day.

Crosby sounds like fun but my september and October are booked with scouting events so I'll be researching gear and taking refresher courses during the winter and getting out next spring. Soooo I got time to learn what I want and need. I am initially trying to develop a short list for trials.

[LKunze]

One thing to note is that DUI is the only company that offers "crushed neoprene".  Other manufacturers offer "compressed" neoprene.  There is a difference in the two.  Check out DUI's site for details on their manufacturing process.  Both are more durable than a nylon shell suit like a TLS350.  I used a TLS350 for about 4 or 5 years and it held up great.  Never had a single leak in it.  I currently am using a Diving Concepts Duraflex Tek which is all cordura like the DUI CLX450.  Very heavy duty suits but a little less mobility than a TLS350 or a CF200 because the cordura material is stiffer.  The only downside I see to the compressed or crushed neoprene suits is the weight.  They are heavy, especially when wet and they take a long time to dry out.  The mobility is second to none though.  They are comfortable suits.  I tried a DUI CF200 before I bought my TLS350 and it was a nice suit.  If you can fit into a stock size suit go that route.  Resale value will not be as good on a non-stock sized suit.  Had I to do it over I would have saved the extra cash and just bought a stock size suit rather than a custom size.

[Scouter]

Ah! I had not picked up on that difference. I'll check it out! Where did you get the chance to try the CF200? Was that at the dog days event?

You have used nylon, neoprene, and cordura. Cost aside, which is the best in your opinion and why? Then factoring in cost would you take a different stand?

Really good input

Thank you!

Brian

[ballfrog]

I own both a back zip and front diagonal zip.  

The back zip is *much* easier to get into and out of regarding my shoulders, expecially when I have my heavy underwear on.  The front zip is much easier to zip and unzip by myself, but I have to channel Houdini to get it on and off my shoulders.

I'm a short, fat guy, so the stock suits don't fit all that well, but I'm also quite cheap so I didn't spring for a custom suit.

The back zip, a Whites Nexus nylon shell, fits fairly well in the upper body, but if I have heavy underwear on it's like squeezing a golf ball through a garden hose to get my calves through the lower legs.  If you're going to go stock, make sure you try the heaviest underwear you'll wear with the suit.  I use the rock boots with that suit, but they are a pain to get on and laced.  I prefer the ease of just stuffing my feet with their merino wool socks on into the attached boots on my front zip tri-lam.

Weezle undergarments (Weezle Wear is what they call their street clothes) come in three weights.  My opinion is that the heaviest weight looks like overkill for all but ice diving.  Too much insulation results in heavy persperation and soggy undergarments, plus, you have to compensate for the extra bouyancy with additional weight.

[LKunze]

It really comes down to personal preference.  Like I said with the very lightweight nylon material of the TLS350 I never had an issue with durability.  I scraped up against metal in wrecks etc. and never had a hole or tear in the suit.  The issue with a nylon or Cordura suit is that it needs to be big enough so that it does not restrict movement because there is zero stretch in the material.  At the same time you don't want the fit to be so baggy that it traps air making venting an issue as well as cause a lot of unnecessary drag in the water. 

With a crushed or compressed neoprene suit the material will stretch some allowing for a snugger more streamlined fit without losing any mobility.  My TLS350 was baggier fitting than it should have been but not so much that it was a problem for me.  It was a stock suit.  Before that I had bought a second hand CF200 suit and did a couple dives on it before returning it because the size was a bit bigger than I wanted it to be.  Had that suit fit me better I probably would have kept it. 

The cordura material is very durable and will last a LONG time but the con is that it is definitely more restrictive than a lighter shell suit or neoprene variety. 

Had I to do it over again I am not sure what I'd do.  I like aspects of each of the three materials.  I'd recommend attending a demo days event so you can try them all before making a decision.

[Scouter]

LKunze:
Appreciate your sharing. Personal preference is a difficult thing.  It requires experience if it is to be worth anything. Dry suites are are expensive to keep replacing while you learn your real personal preferences. 

You have opened my eyes to thinking that I will rent some of the available suits to see if I can be happy with them and not worry about those models that are not available for now. If I find I am happy with a rental I can buy that model. If not I am no worse off than I am now but at least I will have shrunk the field having eliminated styles, features, materials.

Thanks so much. I'll be taking a dry suit class this winter and will see what rental options are available and start trying. I know I can probably try a Evolution 2 codura and DUI TriLams with out any trouble. Its just trying to find a neoprene to try that seems to be tough.

Again Thanks
Brian